July 3, 2008
Charter Review Commission Meeting
Agenda
 
 
I.            Continued review of proposed charter change recommendations.
 
II.        New business

July 3, 2008
Charter Review Commission Meeting
8:30 AM

Chairperson Phyllis Cleveland called the meeting to order at 8:43 AM and thanked everyone for attending.  Richard Horvath began to review the proposals on the Charter.  Chairperson Cleveland also indicated that Councilperson Brian Cummings would be coming in at 9:00 AM to speak to the Commission about his Council rightsizing proposal and that Bill Callahan has a proposal that he would like to present as well.

Richard Horvath presented the recommendations made by the Campaign Finance Sub-committee on campaign finance reform.  Comments were made about the campaign finance issue and were discussed among the Charter Review Commission members. Bill Callahan mentioned that at some point Council has the right to make decisions on the campaign finance reform policy and the reports that are to be used.  Matthew Silverstein mentioned that even though he agrees on this point the electorate still has the ability to vote on this policy.  Richard Horvath mentioned that it becomes very confusing if you give people a law that is different from the state law, he would prefer to keep it the same and if you do something different it confuses everyone. 

Roosevelt Coats mentioned who would be the keeper of the reports within the council? Kevin Kelley mentioned that it would have to be specified by ordinance, which is the clerk of council. 

Richard Horvath mentioned about the draft for Council rightsizing that was introduced by the Council President Martin Sweeney.  Horvath proceeded to explain the proposals, which the Council President wanted to put on the 2009 ballot.  Richard Horvath then proceeded to explain the rest of the Council rightsizing proposal.  There needs to be a provision included that if the council does not act by a certain date, then the Mayor would submit to Council a plan for re-dividing the city into the required number of wards.

Roosevelt Coats mentioned that if we decide to go with the rightsizing the time frame the election should remain the way it is.  Richard Horvath mentioned because of the need to get petition signatures on the ballot for a candidate to run for office, you may need to move the time-table up sooner.  Bill Callahan mentioned that the timeline should be kept where it is at for 2009.  Matthew Silverstein mentioned if the election could be delayed every 10 years, until the redistricting is done and the ward boundaries adjusted. 

Mabel Jasper mentioned about the population dynamics and how this can change over time for the City of Cleveland.  There are some wards that have no problems and other wards have many problems, why is the size of Council just associated with the size of the population?  Richard Horvath mentioned that the population method has been constitutionally proven and if you add other factors into the rightsizing of Council there could be constitutional problems that may come up. 

Robert Triozzi mentioned that he is concerned about the historical data regarding undercounting of the census population. Richard Horvath mentioned that the census uses population estimates; Triozzi mentioned that he would like to hear from James Dykes the Council consultant in regards to the issue of population undercounting.  The question was raised if a factor could be determined to come up with a means for taking into account the undercount factor when it comes to estimating the population.

Roosevelt Coats mentioned that a lot would depend on what the numbers are in regards to the population and what the undercount could be.  Bill Callahan mentioned that if there is a general political consensus in the city that the US Census cannot be trusted, then someone needs to be delegated to determine what the city position is on the issue of undercounting and how this needs to be addressed.  Someone needs to be in charge of making that determination. 

Richard Horvath mentioned that you need data block by block and the census is the only way to get this information in regards to doing the population count.  Roosevelt Coats mentioned that it is an awesome task to determine the population of the city of Cleveland. 

Greg Huth mentioned that Key Bank had done a study on population in local area to find out about demographics in many of the neighborhood areas in order to determine its immediate market saturation.  Richard Horvath mentioned that if Council is adjusting the size of its body based on population then it would want to have the population as high as possible, which could present a problem if Council were to use another methodology for determining the local population.

Kevin Kelley mentioned that we need to determine how inaccurate the census data really is in relation to population.  This would give us an ideal on how accurate the census count really is.  Robert Triozzi mentioned that the starting point is with the census because it has been constitutionally proven and we should look at other way to just tweak it.   

Ward 15 Councilman Brian Cummins came to the table to address the commission members about his proposal to reduce the size the City Council.  Brian Cummins commented about the undercount and mentioned that it was 3.3% for the African American population in the city of Cleveland that was based on the research he has done.  23,000 to 27,000 people were estimated to be undercounted with the majority of them being children according to Councilman Cummins. 

Cummins mentioned that he had lived in Columbus and was struck by their at-large council system.  Cummins mentioned that Columbus has a 7 at large council system and the planning commission plays a larger role in population analysis and redrawing the Council ward boundaries.  Cummins also mentioned Kathleen Barber who had done the county reform study several years ago, where she had proposed an at large county council proposal.  Cummins mentioned that he spoke with academia, business representatives while he conducted his research to get their opinions and views about the size of council.  What matters most; is the people who are within the system. Cummins also mentioned about the city manager form of government with an at-large council that Cleveland had back in 1929.  The city’s population rate from the 1930s to 60s was fairly stable but the primary population loss occurred in the 70s and 80s. 

For the last 27 years the population loss is comparable to what the city had experienced in the 1970s and 80s.  The people in the system are the critical issue. When we make changes to govern a governmental system, people like stability.  Cummins commented that the political leadership in the region, county and city is lacking in examining and promoting government reform.  The governance component, especially reform and regionalism was left out of the agenda of the African American political leadership. 

Cummins also commented about the dynamics that are emerging in various communities across the country and region and how infrastructure needs are different in many of the suburbs compared to Cleveland.  Cummins went through the three the three proposals in his document that he provided to Commission members.

Roosevelt Coats raised the question of infrastructure being different in other cities and not being the same and ask if it was suggested that the poor population need less representation.  Cummins mentioned that was not the case and that Cleveland is the driving engine for the state economy and for the last 20 years cities of our size have been forces to deal with globalization and regionalism. In historical governance literature there has been a movement from at-large system to a mixed system.  Cummins mentioned that the scope of problems that we are dealing with today are much different compared to what they were years ago and that they have taken on a more global and regional perspective, we have to react and respond differently.

A comment was made that Cleveland does not deserve less representation but need better representation in dealing with global and regional problems.  Cummins mentioned that this proposal is for good governance and need to look at Council’s budget when the last downsizing of council was done to see what the impact was on financial savings. 

Matthew Silverstein asked about how would Cummins proposal lead to better government?  Brian Cummins mentioned it would provide the ability to offer more ideas and diverse opinions regarding issues and problems facing the city.  If at-large seats were added to council and you have staggered terms it could help the city move forward in dealing with citywide issues and provide much more discourse and conversation with the citizens in looking at city problems.  It would have the local officials going out into the community more often to talk to the citizenry about the issues facing Cleveland. 

Mabel Jasper requested an example of citywide issues that could be handled by a committee that the council would set up. Jasper also expressed concern whether this could work.  Brian Cummins mentioned about the safety forces being a huge issue, especially emergency medical services and trying to drive changes on how we provide service delivery to our citizens.  Cummins mentioned that City Council has not been as strong in driving such changes in regards to the safety issues.  Cummins mentioned that he personally does not have the time to delve into these issues as he would like.  Having the opportunity to have a robust discourse on ideas how to improve safety services in Cleveland would be good.  Fire and EMS has been a very big issue, and locally it is hard to get the fire and EMS unit to work together on solving service delivery problems.  An  at-large council member could spend more time in looking at the major problems and issues more thoroughly.  You are also adding democracy to the council, and you are strengthening the legislative profile of the body by having an at-large council member.

Patricia Britt mentioned that the constituents elect the council who then elect the council president which is in her opinion democracy.  Brian Cummins had disagreed with this observation. 

Bill Callahan mentioned about the proposals especially at-large council members and asked if this would achieve what the council person wants to see.  Callahan mentioned that it can be so busy for the elected official to think about the big issues, and asked Cummins why he thinks it would improve the likelihood to deal with those other problems by having a smaller council.  Cummins mentioned that his opinion was formed by the peer review he had conducted with the other cities. 

Brian Cummins mentioned his study showing the population trends and projected trends.  Callahan asked if the councilperson feels that he has sufficient resources that would allow the Councilperson to meet the challenges in local governance today.  Phyllis Cleveland raised the same question and mentioned that there are so many demands to the job where she does not have enough time to spend on looking at policy. Questioned whether councilmatic reduction can really help Council do an better job. 

Brian Cummins also mentioned about wards being realigned by district, which would change the way things are done and how the local development corporations are arranged.  The 311 call center was mentioned, which by 2010 the administration hopes to have in place.  The majority of constituency calls are for service and the 311 calls could reduce the volume of calls to council, and what happened to other cities that went to a 311 call system need to be looked at to determine what the actual impact is.  Efficiencies in the local government via 311 system and the impact this would this have on council in reducing the volume of calls is something that we need to look at. 

Bill Callahan mentioned about multifaceted problems and issues that councilperson faces and how would this affect that.  Brian Cummins mentioned how one major structural change can bring about the changes in the other forms of government.  Callahan asked how reducing the size of City Council would bring about these other changes in city government. 

Patrick Mangan embraced the idea of seeing other changes occur and need to change the structure of things and there was another similar idea that was proposed to add to council three additional members at large was recommended 20 years ago.  The current number of 21 plus three members at large proposal had lost by a 7 to 6 vote back in 1988 when this was done. How would you address the three members at large spots in regards to addressing the functioning of this system within a ward based council system was a question that was raised. 

Roosevelt Coats mentioned that people who call the council office have called everyone else and have not received the results that they wanted from the Mayor’s office.  Every administrator will tell the citizens to call their councilperson if they want something done. 

Patrick Mangan mentioned there was frustration in council because the commissioners and directors have one boss to answer to (Mayor) and the at-large issue should be looked at.  Phyllis Cleveland mentioned that this is an issue that needs to be looked at and the commission has a short time left to examine the proposals and asked Brian Cummins to give the commission his best proposal and time frame, and if he is proposing something that could be put on the ballot next year.  Cummins would like the 14 with 3 at large council members as the model.

It was also mentioned that you do not have official census with detail information, and summer of 2010 census blocks estimates will be put in 2009 info that will not come out until 2010 (summer) and does not know how the redistricting will occur. 

There were also other items that were brought up as well. The issue of staggered terms has value which should not be underestimated.  Another option would be to have everyone run in 2009 for 2 year terms, and adjust after that to take into consideration decennial census.

Minority representation in city of Cleveland and distribution on population change over that past years and commented that that this is very important and how do these potentials changes impact how people are represented.  75% of the population loss came from the east side of the city from 1990 to 2000.  Fear is that the African American population as a whole could be facing under-representation. 

Horvath mentioned if there should be a draft of all three proposals submitted by Cummins to the Commission and Cleveland mentioned that they should be drafted up, one of the models would also include an – at-large council president

Coats had suggested that Horvath and Cummins get together to discuss the specific languages for the proposals.  Coats also mentioned that the poor population is usually those who are not counted according to the National League of Cities.  Coats also mentioned that the 14 and 3 at large council members would be the same number as proposed by the council president. 

Public safety is a citywide issue and the safety committee addresses it as a citywide issue, and council is impacted by the legislation that is passed and we all represent the city of Cleveland. It is the citywide issues that we talk about. 

Chairperson Cleveland mentioned that this will be taken into consideration. 

Callahan mentioned about the proposal that came up 20 years ago, and commented that the service end needs to be reorganized.  Horvath mentioned if there was any language with this proposal and Callahan mentioned that there was no language. 

Cleveland mentioned that there are additional working sessions that need to be done and an e-mail will be distributed to determine what dates or times will be best for commission members to meet.  Question on methodology on how commission will make determination on voting on proposals was discussed.  Horvath mentioned that final number of proposals should be sent to every member and have each member of the Commission pick the top ten proposals that are considered to be the best.

Phyllis Cleveland mentioned that the Greater Cleveland Partnership will be coming in next week to speak to the Commission and that one proposal may be coming in from the administration. 

Chairperson Cleveland adjourned meeting at 10:44 AM.