Charter Review Commission
May 8, 2008
Agenda
We will meet in Cleveland City Council’s Committee Room (217).
Cleveland City Council security has asked that Commission Members that are not Members or staff of Cleveland City Council refrain from entering Council offices without an escort.
1) Presentation by Bob Dykes of Triad Research Group on Council Reduction
2) Continuation of Port Control
Charter Commission Review
May 8, 2008
Chairperson Phyllis Cleveland called the meeting to order at 8:43 AM and introduced Robert Dykes of the Triad Research Group to talk to the Commission members about rightsizing City Council. Mr. Dykes provided to commission members the background of his work in the area of demographic analysis and redrawing city council boundaries. Robert Dykes has also indicated that he was involved in the last reduction of Council and did redraw the ward lines which were accepted by the Council and was not challenged in court. The Triad Group has also done work on other political districts at the local, state, and county level, and explained that the group has the background and ability to do this kind of work.
Robert Dykes also raised the question what is the right-size for Cleveland City Council. The question of exploring the right size of Council and how do we get to that point was raised by Robert Dykes to the Charter Commission. In other cities there is a wide variation on the number of members that City Council has. Perhaps the way in which council might go forward in the future in redrawing the ward lines should be examined further. There could be limitations on what the ward lines can do. The Census Bureau looks at blocks as the smallest unit of population. You cannot divide blocks in regards to what the census provides. There is another level that the city is divided into as neighborhoods. These places have meanings for the residents in the city and there are 36 spas in the city. Question was raised regarding how many of these 36 neighborhoods are in one ward and the response was that only 2 of them are. Many of the neighborhood SPAs are in three wards and the question is whether neighborhoods can be used as building blocks in constructing council wards in the future.
We need to look at what the benefits and drawbacks of making those changes are in regards to wards.
Phyllis Cleveland raised the question about community development corporations in regards to the neighborhoods that they are involved in and indicated that it can become real complicated and every ten years we have to redraw boundaries and this can become real broad. Cleveland also mentioned about the redrawing of the new police districts and the fact that the neighborhoods were drawn up 30 years ago. Dykes mentioned that he was not aware that the neighborhood SPAs were not changed in 30 years, he would suggest that the Planning Dept readjust neighborhood boundaries periodically to make changes in the neighborhoods from time to time.
Bill Callahan raised a question if Robert Dykes was working for the Council at this time and Dykes indicated that a proposal was submitted for Council by Triad for review and they have to make revisions to it. Callahan also brought up the matter regarding the timeline for the council right sizing issue and expressed concern about the length of time that would be involved for Dykes and his group to complete this project.
Bill Callahan raised another question if the Triad group could spend time meeting with people outside of the charter commission to answer questions they would have regarding the process of right-sizing. Dykes mentioned that determination would need to be decided by the Chairperson. Dykes mentioned that one of the recommendations may be that the city needs to periodically redraw the neighborhood boundaries.
Anton Farmsby mentioned that with the census being done every ten years would the redrawing of neighborhood lines be done every ten years just like the census count or before the census is done? Dykes mentioned that the decision would be with the Council in regards to redrawing the neighborhood boundary lines. Dykes mentioned that are several data companies that use population software to track population changes in an area over time and they can run models to estimate the population. Based on real counts from the census data, these models have been adjusted to become more accurate in making population estimates.
Chairperson Cleveland mentioned if the Commission makes a recommendation regarding the size of Council what would be the effective date and once this is determined would we have to go back after the next census in 2010 to do this process again in regards to redrawing the boundary lines, is this something that we would need to do?
Kevin Kelley mentioned about looking at the population data and where it is, and the fact that it will be up to Council to use the data and to make the determination on what the number should be in the Council in regards to right-sizing.
Robert Triozzi asked the question as to what was the driving value in regards to looking at the neighborhoods and boundary lines. Dykes mentioned about a lawsuit brought against the city, which pertained to the one person one vote rule and the Supreme Court mentioned that the wards had to be redrawned, since that time in all cities that elect council members on a ward basis there is a protocol related to the range of population change in an area– if the population of any ward varies + or -5% then there is no change. It is the population that is the driving force. Driving force is to retain as much of an area in a ward or district according to Dykes.
Greg Huth asked the question what were the values of drawing the lines and making reductions in Council before, which had occurred in 1981. Dykes mentioned that the rationale was a sense of fairness where the intention was to combine these wards where all Council members would have a chance of winning the election and 25 members voted in favor of that particular plan and the ward lines were redrawn in a fairly equitable way. Dykes indicated that he did not know how the 21 number was arrived at.
Mabel Jasper raised the question in regards to what are the criteria for the number of Council members and how is this determined. There are also more challenges and problems that are being faced in the city today and Jasper indicated that other criteria need to be established as well. Jasper also raised the question as to what are the actual steps in order to determine this. Dkyes mentioned that such steps in regards to other criteria would be a determination made by the Commission.
Silverstein mentioned that he is interested in what assistance could be provided by Dykes and his group? Dykes mentioned he could look at historical relationship between size of council and the city itself, and look at the rationale on what is being done. Omsbudman function was something mentioned by Dykes and he mentioned that he does not know if this is true in other cities. Dykes also added that he will look at some of the questions that come up in regards to council.
Bill Callahan mentioned about looking at the job description of the council members and to see if other people do the job of the councilperson if it cannot be done by the elected official. Phyllis Cleveland mentioned that in regards to council and the criteria for right-sizing that is something that the commission has to determine.
Mabel Jasper mentioned that Council plays an important role by getting information from people in the community and use such information to make laws. This is the first line of help for the citizens in relation to quality of life problems, and there needs to be more emphasis on other factors besides just population.
Ken Johnson mentioned about the relationship with constituents and the jobs of the council are stated in the rules. Councilpersons started answering constituent’s complaints when the administration has not performed, people think that Council can help them get those things done and they can make the council members accountable because they can vote them out of office if they don’t perform to the citizen’s satisfaction.
Anton Farmsby mentioned that the expectations of council are in eyes of beholder and agreed that they are the first line of defense for constituents in the ward in addressing and dealing with neighborhood issues. Look at volume of work that various members do and we should take this into consideration as well.
Roosevelt Coats mentioned that Dykes has the expertise to look at this issue. There are some cities that have council members at large and that council is on the front lines in terms of what happened in the last reduction. There was a comment made on what motivated the initiation of those petitions that went out for the last council reduction that ended up nearly reducing council in half.
The motivating factor should not only be the city’s population and the other issue is that the position itself is part time which makes council similar to other cities as well as different from some cities as well. Dykes mentioned that there are some cities where all council members are elected at large. In those cities the council is much smaller and functions much differently than this council in Cleveland.
Ken Johnson mentioned the reason why there were 33 council members in the past, which was due to many neighborhoods and ethnic communities who wanted their own representatives. This was also a strong union town as well, and people wanted someone to represent their views. We have also taken into consideration the neighborhoods in Cleveland.
Dykes mentioned that one of the driving factors in the balkanization of the many ethnic groups, the council person could speak the language of the ethnic constituents in the neighborhoods and this was a big factor for the ward based system and the number of council persons who were in office during that time.
Coats mentioned if the population of the city will be looked at in regards to estimations? Dykes mentioned that the population estimations will be looked at as well.
Vicky Johnson mentioned about adding % over the census numbers, and how do you compensate for social contacts that come into the area. Dykes mentions that census is not perfectly accurate and in neighborhoods that we have in Cleveland. Dykes further added that the courts are reluctant to make any ruling in regards to adjustment in the census. When the council is redrawing the ward lines the current law requires that census data be used, and you can adjust + or -5% factor if there is suspicion that the population may be higher in certain areas.
Ken Johnson mentioned about whether the models of companies that perform population estimation are more accurate and wanted Dykes to explain more about that. Dykes mentioned that the companies rely on other information such as birth, death records and automobile registrations and this could be one of the reasons why they may be more accurate than the census.
Chairperson Cleveland mentioned that we are working to meet a timeline and that if anyone has further questions to get them to Mr. Dykes, and that the community public meetings that were originally scheduled for May will be pushed back to June after the Council recess.
Port Control was called to the table next to continue the discussion on Port Control.
Greg Huth raised a question about design-build concept and raised concern about the willingness of the design team that is out of town to work with a construction team locally. Huth expressed some concern about that. Airport Director Smith mentioned that Continental has used local firms to do work on their project, and this is something that the administration is very sensitive to and is watching this very closely to make sure that such partnerships are occurring.
Director Smith mentioned that another proposal pertains to the airport fire service, that responds to air rescue and fire suppression to building structures at the airport. Safety Director Martin Flask commented that at one time he was over the airport security operations and mentioned that the fire staff has two levels of certifications. Emts and paramedics and airport fire staff has those skills and are well trained and equipped at the airport.
Airport Commissioner Fred Szabo found documents that show that this arc unit has been in place for many years and the arc firefighters are specifically trained to handle aircraft fires and other fire suppression technique at airport site and that such training is very specialized, and there would be clear structure in organization to show who is responsible for doing what and that the fire component at the airport would be its own separate entity at the airport.
Smith mentioned that this is a highly regulated function and would have to be reported to the federal government. This proposal would provide authority of the port control to create the arc unit at the airport and the service would hire chief that would report directly to the director of airport operations.
Colleen Gilson raised question if this is more of a management situation and smith mentioned that this is level of oversight.
Ken Johnson mentioned there is always a concern whenever you create a private police operation. Appointing authority would be Director Smith and the organization structure was explained by Smith in regards to chain of command and organizational structure of the safety operation. Johnson raised the question how is the airport going to hire the safety personnel for the airport operations?
Smith mentioned that national search would be done for police chief. Flask mentioned that the state sets the minimum threshold for the police and fire personnel. The officers would go through the police academy.
Ken Johnson mentioned about the promotional apparatus and how it would work at the airport? Smith mentioned that all city civil service rules and requirements would apply to the airport. Someone from the police force can also apply for the positions at the airport.
Kelley mentioned that this is a public police force not a private police force, and to the fire issue, is this an issue that the TSA stay out of. According to Director Smith the TSA focuses entirely on the airport security issues.
Szabo mentioned that the FAA is aware of and in support of the ARC proposal.
Coats mentioned about the separate police force at airport and if there is any disruption in the regular police force would it spill over to the airport police and concern about the city being involved in litigation because the regular police force has been involved in the airport for may years,
Triozzi mentioned that once the structural process is put into place then civil service rule will be applied including other rules and regulations, and there is no way to predict that this will not be put into litigation and there is no way to predict that litigation will happen.
Roosevelt Coats is concerned that this could cost the city millions of dollars if litigation should occur.
Smith mentioned that there is a risk at the airport if there is no safety security operation structure at the airport. There are requirements that are required by the FAA and if those are not met then the airport would close. This would be done in the interest of public security and this is why it is important to have this kind of safety structure in place at the airport.
Coats raised concerned if these security steps and coverage is in place now and whether we are at risk. Smith mentioned that the security challenges and requirements have increased and have made this so demanding that a separate police arrangement at the airport is needed.
Cleveland mentioned that federal security record is on record supporting the ARC proposal and request documentation from the director showing that the federal agency accepts and agrees with this approach.
Patrick Managan mentioned about the other police entities and role that they would play at airport.
Ken Johnson mentioned that if this is done we won’t have the opportunity to undo it for 20 years. Security force being created at airport is mandated by whom? Smith mentioned that it is an ideal by Flask and was first proposed by the White Administration. Flask also mentioned other safety challenges in post 9/11 such as threat levels and upgrade in security measures has been major reasons for the need of a security operation at the airport.
Smith mentioned that if there were to be a major emergency out at the airport, the police division would respond.
Ken Johnson raised question as to who would be in charge at the airport when something occurs that would constitute major emergency. Airport police department would be the first contact. Smith also mentioned that the airport police force would be responsible for maintaining safety at airport in safety incident to maintain order. There would be other federal agencies that would come in to do their analysis of the scene. Flask mentioned that the protocols are the same as with all the other police forces throughout the region.
Gillson mentioned why is the fire chief not here for this discussion, Flask mentioned that was oversight on his part.
Farmsby commented will these staff be union and the answer was yes they will be part of a union. How does the hierarchy streamline the command of security with so many other agencies from the federal government involved? Smith mentioned that there will be coordination involved with other agencies and that would depend on the incident involved because each incident has specific elements to it.
Vicky Johnson raised the question on how much impact would a separate police force would have on city budget. Flask mentioned that presently there is a $5 MM agreement with the airport and police division. There would be an additional $2.5 MM impact on the budget under this new approach.
Meeting adjourned at 10:33 AM by Chairperson Cleveland; next week the Commission will be reviewing the Public Safety Department.
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